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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:11 pm 
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Blaziken
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I'm sure everyone's already run across it by now, but just in case...
http://serebii.net/generation5/

Let's expect 100 more...?


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:23 pm 
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Mew
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Going off some some fairly credible rumors and the amount of time that usually passes between new generations, it's quite possible that the gen 5 games will hit Japan late this year. Though, as much as I've enjoyed all the new Pokémon games, I've got to wonder if we really need another 100 pokémon... What I want is a MMO.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 5:31 pm 
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A Pokemon MMO is what everyone wants. It's just too bad Nintendo wouldn't allow one at all.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 10, 2010 6:08 pm 
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Mew
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I'm sure it'll come eventually, once Nintendo manages to get over its aversion to online gaming (and does away with friend codes). Something else I'd kind of like to see is a more action based take on the battle system. Maybe something like Spectrobes...

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2010 5:02 pm 
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I hope not. I think they should complete the franchise now that Arceus is out.

Pokemon is dead IMO. If not, than it should die sometime soon.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 1:46 pm 
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Pokémon is dead, huh? Yeah, tell that to the game sales charts. Pokémon games, especially the main series ones, always sell extremely well. The Pokémon fad died out a long time ago, but the series isn't showing any signs of death in the US or Japan. And, while I do think the number of different pokémon is getting overly high, the games themselves are still fun and well made and each version adds new improvements. Just because you don't like them anymore, is no reason to say the series should die. I'm not very fond of Halo, but that doesn't mean I want the series to die. There's plenty of people who really like it and no law saying I have to play it, so what's the big deal? They could release a new Halo game every year if they want to. It won't bother me.

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 7:28 pm 
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No, and I didn't even mean it that way. :/

Even I, one of the biggest fanboys of Halo, think the series should die. The series has gotten very weak since the first few games, and it will just grow weaker as time goes by. In fact, not every Pokemon fanboy you will meet will enjoy the 5th generation. I'd rather see Pokemon just end a success, as I will admit it is right now. But for all we know, Nintendo may just fail with the 5th generation and Pokemon will die a failure.

Sonic the Hedgehog, for example, used to be one of the most successful platformers of all time. Ever since they went 3D, it was revolutionary BUT only for a short time. The release of Sonic 2006 came out, possibly the worst game in the series. A few more successes known as Sonic Unleashed and Sonic and the Secret Rings were good. But all in all, all the new Sonic games are mediocre and poor compared to what the franchise used to be. If Sonic 4 is really good, it means Sega's last stand.

Sure, not every series makes that decision. But I don't have high hopes for the 5th generation as much as I did the 4th. Pokemon isn't even as popular as it used to be, the same with many other franchises such as Final Fantasy, Castlevania, and even Mario.

I wish the Poke fanboys luck on the new generation, but I'm afraid to say that Nintendo might not do as excellent as Gen 4. :/

(Some of this quoted by Silver) My poor, poor Final Fantasy X... Reputation completely ruined by FFX-2 and Square Enix...

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 9:06 pm 
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Wait, what? "Some of this quoted by Silver"? I didn't quote anything except the part about how I apparently quoted something. What are you talking about?

Also... most companies aren't that stupid. By which I mean, if a series is successful, they don't just stop making them. "That last game was great! We got excellent reviews, sold millions of copies, and everyone liked it! Well, time to stop making them now." So even if you think it's time for Pokemon to stop, most fans probably don't (or at least would buy the new games, despite complaining about them). Pokemon may not have all the hype it did when it first started, but the Diamond/Pearl generation still made it on to just about every top seller chart I know of. It's still plenty popular. If you're losing interest, then don't buy the new games. The series won't die just because you think it should end. While I'll agree there's quite enough Pokemon already and introducing more is kind of pushing it... this isn't going to be enough to kill the series, they'll still sell just fine, and as far as I'm concerned... long live Pokemon.

Now Give me that MMO already, Nintendo...

Also "then". Not "than". I've been over this before...

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PostPosted: Tue Feb 16, 2010 9:27 pm 
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I wasn't attacking Pokemon at all, okay? But I even know some Pokemon fanboys who say they won't bother to buy the 5th gen Pokemon games because they thought it will be crap. The same with Final Fantasy XIII, nobody wants to buy that game because they think Square Enix has already killed Final Fantasy.

Poke fanboys like some on this forum (no offense, okay?) have all the right to say long live Pokemon. But yet again, I must warn you about the multiple haters of the 5th gen. I'm not going to assume it will be bad, but there's always that time when a franchise goes downhill.

Speaking of an MMO, I've heard of Shoddy Battle which works like one. It's more of a battle simulator, but you should give it a try. The only problem with a Pokemon MMO would be it could be even more addicting than the average games.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 12:29 am 
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So some Pokémon fans may not want to buy the 5th generation games. So what? Quite a lot will want to buy them and they're sure to attract some new players as well. Not everyone has been playing Pokémon since 1st gen, or even 4th gen for that matter.

And what the heck do you mean no one wants to buy Final Fantasy XIII? It sold millions of copies in Japan already and has an enormous amount of US pre-orders. Sure there's some people who like to whine about how the older FF games were better, but for all their complaining most of them still buy each new one. And, for that matter, there's plenty of FF fans, myself included, who think that (for the most part) the games just keep getting better. The professional reviews are all crazy about XIII as well (near perfect score in Famitsu, 9.25 in Game Informer, etc). Internet trolls really aren't the best source to judge a game or series's popularity. They just like to whine because it makes them feel "important".

Silver's right. Killing off a successful popular series is, from a business prospective, just plain stupid. From a "quality" perspective, it's iffy. Even if one game in a series is bad, that doesn't neccessarily mean the next one will be. There's plenty of series that have had a bad game or two only to come back with an awesome title later on. And, as long as it's making money, that's technically the most important thing for most companies (just look at most Hollywood movies these days). The only logical reason to kill off a series while it's still popular is if the story is finished. For example, God of War III is supposed to complete Kratos's story. So, if Sony decides to end the series after III, it kinda makes sense since the plot that's been running through the entire series is over. .Hack is supposed to complete its big story and end for good after this last batch of games as well. But for series like Pokémon and Final Fantasy, where each game isn't part of a single continuous plot, there's no reason to end them as long as people keep wanting more of them.

And it's wrong to assume that all franchises eventually go downhill. Pokémon hasn't (some of the spin-offs have been iffy, but the main series games keep getting a little better each time). Final Fantasy hasn't (at least according to most fans). Mario and Zelda certainly haven't either. And there's plenty more. Yeah Sonic has gone seriously downhill, and it's dissapointing, but the "bad" Sonic games have still been selling really well. And if Sonic 4 turns out to be really good, I certainly wouldn't want Sega to end the series there, I'd want more. And, even if they screw up Sonic 4, if enough people like Sonic games enough to keep buying them then Sega should keep making them. I'll keep hoping that Sonic Team get's their act together, but as long as some people are enjoying them and they're profitable, I wouldn't really want them to kill the series.

On a side note: as for FFX-2... Yeah, it had its problems but, overall, most people who took the time to play the whole thing will admit that it was actually a pretty good game.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:51 am 
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Josiah wrote:
So some Pokémon fans may not want to buy the 5th generation games. So what? Quite a lot will want to buy them and they're sure to attract some new players as well. Not everyone has been playing Pokémon since 1st gen, or even 4th gen for that matter.

And what the heck do you mean no one wants to buy Final Fantasy XIII? It sold millions of copies in Japan already and has an enormous amount of US pre-orders. Sure there's some people who like to whine about how the older FF games were better, but for all their complaining most of them still buy each new one. And, for that matter, there's plenty of FF fans, myself included, who think that (for the most part) the games just keep getting better. The professional reviews are all crazy about XIII as well (near perfect score in Famitsu, 9.25 in Game Informer, etc). Internet trolls really aren't the best source to judge a game or series's popularity. They just like to whine because it makes them feel "important".

Silver's right. Killing off a successful popular series is, from a business prospective, just plain stupid. From a "quality" perspective, it's iffy. Even if one game in a series is bad, that doesn't neccessarily mean the next one will be. There's plenty of series that have had a bad game or two only to come back with an awesome title later on. And, as long as it's making money, that's technically the most important thing for most companies (just look at most Hollywood movies these days). The only logical reason to kill off a series while it's still popular is if the story is finished. For example, God of War III is supposed to complete Kratos's story. So, if Sony decides to end the series after III, it kinda makes sense since the plot that's been running through the entire series is over. .Hack is supposed to complete its big story and end for good after this last batch of games as well. But for series like Pokémon and Final Fantasy, where each game isn't part of a single continuous plot, there's no reason to end them as long as people keep wanting more of them.

And it's wrong to assume that all franchises eventually go downhill. Pokémon hasn't (some of the spin-offs have been iffy, but the main series games keep getting a little better each time). Final Fantasy hasn't (at least according to most fans). Mario and Zelda certainly haven't either. And there's plenty more. Yeah Sonic has gone seriously downhill, and it's dissapointing, but the "bad" Sonic games have still been selling really well. And if Sonic 4 turns out to be really good, I certainly wouldn't want Sega to end the series there, I'd want more. And, even if they screw up Sonic 4, if enough people like Sonic games enough to keep buying them then Sega should keep making them. I'll keep hoping that Sonic Team get's their act together, but as long as some people are enjoying them and they're profitable, I wouldn't really want them to kill the series.

On a side note: as for FFX-2... Yeah, it had its problems but, overall, most people who took the time to play the whole thing will admit that it was actually a pretty good game.


Nice, I have same thoughts somtimes spin-offs or some games in series are bad but that dont mean that whole series startsbad after those games and some times it goes downhill when starts back up. So Josiah is right.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:53 am 
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But anyways getting back on topic

5th Genereation looks promising and i hope they have some good graphics and gameplay. And Music. I hate when game have horrible music it just messes up the game.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 17, 2010 5:11 pm 
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(b4 I leave for good. I wanna finish this discussion, it seems interesting.)

@Josiah

Then again, Earthbound was a fantastic RPG, possibly one of the best, but it sold horribly compared to the Pokemon games. If only the series continued on, it would probably be in the same popularity category other popular franchises are in.

A popular game does not always get good reviews, too. Diamond and Pearl may have been one of the most popular games, but the reviews were only great enough to be called a good game. A good game, yes. But the best of all time? We can't say that.

Another thing, Pokemon is declining in popularity. Sure, all the 9-year olds still play it, but the fanbase is rather shrinking and the only ones left, really, are the competitive players. Pokemon was originally meant to be fun for kids, but now more and more competition grows within the games. In fact, lots of game reviewers claim Pokemon to be a "drug" in competitive play. It's really not much of a fun game anymore, unless you think of it that way.

I don't mind at all if Pokemon continues. But in my personal opinion, it needs to die off sometime soon.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:12 am 
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Yes, good games don't always sell as well as they should. But that's kind of beside the point.

Also, yes, some games that sell well don't get great reviews. But what's that got to do with this? I don't recall anyone calling Diamond/Pearl the best game of all time. Might be the best Pokémon game, but that's beside the point as well. They got a Metacritic rating of around 84% (which is pretty good for Metacritic) and tended to score in the 8-9 (out of 10) range from most major magazines and games web sites. That's pretty good. They even won a few best handheld game of the year awards back when they were released.

And I don't know why you say they're declining in popularity. Lots of kids still play Pokémon and so do lots of older players, even those who aren't particularily into the competitive scene. And those kids are part of the fan base well you know. So some older players won't get the new games? So what? There'll be plenty of new players (both kids and some olders ones) starting Pokémon for the first time. D/P actually sold more copies than either Ruby/Sapphire or FireRed/LeafGreen. As of March 2008 they had sold over 17 million copies. And that's sales data from two years ago. Add in the last two years and Platinum and the sales numbers are probably somewhere between 25 and 30 million, maybe higher. So far, Heart Gold and Soul Silver have sold quite well in Japan as well and have received excellent review scores. Keep in most, most games don't even sell several million copies. Pokémon's sales numbers are nothing short of phenominal.

If most people didn't think that Pokémon was fun anymore, it wouldn't sell so well. Like I said, sure some people will get bored with the series and move on, but there's also plenty of new players who haven't played all the previous games. And there's also plenty of people like myself that, despite being around since the first generation, still find the new games a lot of fun (if not all that original). And most of those people aren't competitive players. When you look at the number of people who compete in serious Pokémon tournaments compared to the number of games sold, it's tiny.

Judging from your opinions, I'm guessing you get a lot of your information from online message boards and the like, which is really a poor place to do so since most of them tend to be dominated by a handful of trolls and whiners who just enjoy complaining.

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PostPosted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 12:40 am 
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@White_Samurai

Pokemon is a fun game not Drug plus some i know alot of 9 and above people who play it still. So get your ideas correct but you voice your opinion plus i can understand abit because i know some people who hate Pokemon because they saw the anime and little kid shows and thought Pokemon was stupid but the games are much much more different than those so dont get it mixed up.

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